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I think it's just that the Black Dwarves were less morally inclined (either by race or, more likely, by peer pressure) and often ignored the line between good vs evil, whereas the Red Dwarves tended to disbelieve something if they didn't understand it.
Statistics: Posted by hobbit_of_narnia — Tue Sep 29, 2015 1:05 am
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I think that generally it's the movies and fanfiction that make us think that there was a greater separation between the clans than there really was ever meant to be.
Statistics: Posted by Lucy Took — Tue Sep 29, 2015 12:55 am
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I'm pretty sure there were a few other similar parts in the books as well.
Of the Narnia books, only PC contrasts black and red dwarfs. Not even sure what colour Poggin is, hair colour, that is.As mentioned, he wrote Pilgrim's Regress earlier, and in that black and red dwarfs, surrounding the SAME Barbarian, are an allegory for Commies and Fascists. No, the setting is NOT Narnian and NOT very Medieval. There is also an allegory of Freudian and one of Hegelian ideologies.
My take is that Trumpkin is the doubter or denier, initially, because Commies are often (and back then generally) Atheists, while Nikabrik is ultimately an occultist, because of the news during the war CSL had read that Nazis were into that.
ALL other Narnia books leave out the distinction between black and red dwarfs, except for SC perhaps mentioning Trumpkin's hair colour, if some red remained.
I think not JUST tortured, but some kind of "transhumanism" if you can say so about elves.canonically the orcs in LotR were tortured elves
Statistics: Posted by hansgeorg — Mon Sep 28, 2015 4:23 pm
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@hobbit: ah, yes, I'd forgotten the other Black Dwarfs in PC.
@Lil: he might have said something in Mere Christianity too, but I've only read that once and not as recently as Screwtape.
But no, you're not imagining things.
I found it. It's in chapter Five of Book 1 I want to say? @Lil: he might have said something in Mere Christianity too, but I've only read that once and not as recently as Screwtape.
But no, you're not imagining things.I think he says "Badness is just spoiled goodness."(of and course many other interesting things. I can't remember them all now to post.) which I think runs along similar lines.
Statistics: Posted by Lil — Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:28 am
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But no, you're not imagining things.Statistics: Posted by Ariel.of.Narnia — Mon Sep 21, 2015 2:44 am
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I don't recall anything about Black Dwarfs specifically being on the Witch's side. (Reep says in the PC movie, "Ha! That's rich coming from you, dwarf, or do you forget that it was your people who fought alongside the White Witch?", so he doesn't discriminate necessarily. The LWW film, though, showed Red Dwarfs in Aslan's side and Black Dwarfs on Jadis'.)
As for Lewis addressing evil corrupting but not creating, there are a few places in Screwtape where he says the like.
That would be horrible if I was already mixing the book and movie. As for Lewis addressing evil corrupting but not creating, there are a few places in Screwtape where he says the like.
Good to know. I thought maybe it was in Mere Christianity or somewhere else too. But I can't remember. good to know I'm not imaging things.As for Lewis addressing evil corrupting but not creating, there are a few places in Screwtape where he says the like.
Statistics: Posted by Lil — Sat Sep 19, 2015 7:06 pm
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I don't recall anything about Black Dwarfs specifically being on the Witch's side.
I don't believe Lewis ever mentioned out and out that the Black Dwarves are more evil than the Red Dwarves, that's true. But in the PC book it says that the Black Dwarves Caspian meets offered to introduce him to a hag and a couple other evil creatures, and they were more surly than the Red Dwarves he meets. And Nikabrik (in Aslan's How) mentions that the Witch wasn't evil to the Dwarves. I'm pretty sure there were a few other similar parts in the books as well.Statistics: Posted by hobbit_of_narnia — Sat Sep 19, 2015 3:54 pm
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Statistics: Posted by Ariel.of.Narnia — Sat Sep 19, 2015 4:57 am
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I've always perceived Black Dwarfs to be more on the effectively bent side - seeing as, if I remember correctly, there's actually nothing in LWW to indicate which kind of dwarf the dwarf that serves Jadis the most is.
Though I always thought that, that it was some of the black dwarfs regarding Nikabrik's comments. I thought there was a comment or jab in there somewhere about his people being the ones that served the witch but I can't seem to find it.I think that some of the creatures probably chose (for fear, comfort, or for evil reasons) and some creatures were probably corrupted by the witch
Another interesting theme/concept/idea about evil I have heard is "Evil cannot create anything new, they can only corrupt and ruin what good forces have invented or made. " (source TV Tropes. TV Tropes is not affiliated with TLC.) and is discussed by Tolkien in the Return of the King. ( I want to say I think Lewis might have addressed it in some of his works but I can't find a source.)
Statistics: Posted by Lil — Sat Sep 19, 2015 12:42 am
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Statistics: Posted by Ariel.of.Narnia — Fri Sep 18, 2015 7:51 pm
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